22. How to Take Your Bike on a Plane

Days after recording, Steve was on a flight to Iceland to take on “The Rift” with friends and customers. Inspired by the trip, Kristin & Steve talk about how to travel with your bicycle, specifically on a plane. We share when to consider renting bikes vs bringing your own, and options for packing your bike (bags vs boxes). 

We also discuss Steve’s recent Lyme diagnosis, which threatened his trip to Iceland; answer questions from friends and listeners about mountain bike classifications; mtb technique, cycling caps and how much is a "normal" amount to spend each year to keep your mtb rolling, as well as vent about why the new “trend” to 32″ wheels is a problem.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02: 0:04

This is Kristen.

SPEAKER_00: 0:06

And I'm Steve, and you're listening to Cycling Together, a show about all things bikes, riding, and riding together.

SPEAKER_02: 0:13

Welcome to our another new setup.

SPEAKER_00: 0:15

Another new setup.

SPEAKER_02: 0:17

Trying this. Exactly. I'm enjoying it.

SPEAKER_00: 0:23

For those of you seeing us on video.

SPEAKER_02: 0:24

See us on video. Yes, we're trying um in the guest room without a table. We'll see if we like this. Anyway, by the time we post the show, you, my friend, will be back from a big adventure. Where are you going on Tuesday?

SPEAKER_00: 0:42

I am going to Iceland, which oddly enough is my second time going to Iceland to ride my bike.

SPEAKER_02: 0:50

And why are you riding your bike?

SPEAKER_00: 0:52

So I'm going to I'm going to an event called the Rift. Yes. And the Rift is a gravel race. Um it's one of those races that you know you choose whether to race or to not race, just to ride. Um got it.

SPEAKER_02: 1:07

There are just riding with friends with numbers on our bicycles.

SPEAKER_00: 1:10

Yeah, exactly. And there are there's two lengths. There's a 140k or a 200k, so it's about 87 miles or 125 miles.

SPEAKER_04: 1:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 1:21

Uh most of us, and because I'm going with a large group of guys who I ride with around here. Yes. And uh most of us are doing the sh the short version. So which is like the 87 miles or so. Just eight seven. Um it should take about eight hours on the bike, and it was sort of like that's enough.

SPEAKER_02: 1:45

That it does sound enough. But and we're gonna get we're gonna talk more about your prep and traveling. That's gonna be, I think, the primary theme of today's show. It's gonna be preparing to ride your bike in faraway places, but you nearly two weeks ago, I did not go. And why is that? What happened?

SPEAKER_00: 2:06

I got Lyme disease.

SPEAKER_02: 2:08

Yeah, but it was so weird how it manifested because you had a sore shoulder.

SPEAKER_00: 2:16

I had a sore shore sore shoulder since early May.

SPEAKER_02: 2:19

Yes. Yep. Yep. Went to the Minute Clinic on a Sunday.

SPEAKER_00: 2:24

On a Sunday. Because it started, it was bothering me more that day.

SPEAKER_02: 2:27

And it looked like you had like a spider bite on it or something, like a bug bite, an infected zip. You had something there.

SPEAKER_00: 2:34

Yeah, I did, yeah. That's right. Right? Yep, on top of, yes.

SPEAKER_02: 2:37

And on top of the shoulder. So we so you went to the Minute Clinic and they thought you had shingles. Yes. That you had had a breakthrough, but just a little, just a little bit of shingles because you had had the shingle vaccine. So it was just a little bit of breakthrough. So that seemed reasonable, and there's nothing you do about that.

SPEAKER_00: 2:54

No.

SPEAKER_02: 2:55

And then two weeks ago, you started being I it escalated so fast. So over the shoulders a little sore to I'm in agony.

SPEAKER_00: 3:05

Yeah, over the course of 48 hours, I went to just complete agony. High, high levels of pain. Uh, not being able to sit down, lay down. Yep. Uh not being straps, yep, your neck. Yep. So yeah, couldn't turn my neck, couldn't lift my arm. Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 3:24

This is where you also realize how hard it is to uh with the medical system that we have, it's like he's in agony. Well, we can see you in four days. Fortunately, we have a very good friend and doctor who could see you right away. She's our our back doctor, she's the one who helps you with the back. So she got us in very quickly. And uh, it was interesting watching her assess you because you looked very crooked. You looked crooked, you were holding yourself crooked, and she kept saying, None of this makes sense, none of this makes sense. So she she did push some light cane into your trapezoidal area to release that, which then showed that your shoulder was still probably the problem.

SPEAKER_00: 4:09

The problem, yeah. And then that at least let me sleep a little.

SPEAKER_02: 4:14

Right. And then we got the lime test.

SPEAKER_00: 4:16

And and yeah, and she's like, we have to do a lime test too, because this is weird.

SPEAKER_02: 4:19

Yeah. So that was so it turns out it was Lyme.

SPEAKER_00: 4:22

Which Lyme tests take a take days.

SPEAKER_02: 4:25

Ah, days, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 4:26

They they are not immediate.

SPEAKER_02: 4:28

Um right on a holiday, right? July 4th, trying to figure out how to get medication, how to, you know, again, grateful to our friend Dana, who all helped us make it happen. And so you're on the mend, you're two weeks.

SPEAKER_00: 4:45

Like as soon as I started taking the doxycycline, it was immediate, immediate relief, basically. I mean, you take one out, you take two a day, and every single 12-hour period, I could tell you the improvements that I had made.

SPEAKER_02: 4:58

But it's terrifying. I mean, at one point she was talking about sending you in to the ER for a neurological exam. And we had a customer on Saturday when I was working, um, who was telling me all about how he had been admitted to the hospital for neuro neurological issues related to Lyme. So now I know more about Lyme than I did. Which is a good reminder. Our friend Alex sent me, um, because she was witness to all this because we were in Duxbury while it was happening, she found an article about Lyme and Lyme prevention and some of the things that we can do. So it was from Peter Attica M D. So obviously checking yourself for ticks, which you do all the time.

SPEAKER_00: 5:45

Well, every time, like yeah, I'll go through a field while riding, and then at the end of the field, be like, okay, I just went through a bunch of grass, let me chuck my legs. Yes. And occasionally you're like, oh, there's a little guy.

SPEAKER_02: 5:55

Anders found one, flick him off. We went for a mountain bike ride, and as he got in the car, he found one and flicked it out of the window. So, but prevention is the best medicine. Here's the thing. So they say when you are headed into tick territory, which we live in the middle of, that you should think about light colored clothing and long sleeves and long pants. That's real tough thinking about riding my mountain bike with long sleeves and long pants. That's really not gonna happen. So light colored clothing, um, EPA registered repellents. Basically, use DEET.

SPEAKER_00: 6:33

Yeah, it it's a it's a high amount of DEET. I think it's over 25, 30% you need.

SPEAKER_02: 6:37

Yep. Um do those daily checks. They also talked about how you can treat some of your gear with something called perma. Yeah, I heard about that you can put on your it doesn't help with your body. You cannot apply it to your body. That's what the deeds for. But if you like your pack, your I wonder how long if it anyway, something to look at. Good reminder that lime is super scary, and there's other um tick-borne things like the one where you can become allergic to meat.

SPEAKER_00: 7:13

Yep, that's from a lone star tick. I don't know if that's around here, but what's the other thing?

SPEAKER_02: 7:17

Oh, well, the other thing, there was a there was this article which I'll put in the show notes, had uh a couple of links like you could see in your part of the country where like what ticks were were prevalent, what level they were at, what the danger was, and they even had a little uh form that you could fill out that said, like, what where are you? Did you see a t a tick, or you know, did you get a tick on you? Uh how long was it on? What should you do? And then it took you through the steps to say you sh, you know, you're probably fine, or you should wait and see, or you should consult your medical professional. So anyway, tis tis the season.

SPEAKER_00: 8:03

Anyway, yeah, we did find it, find it just in time to get better so that I can go to Iceland.

SPEAKER_02: 8:10

So you can go to Iceland for what we are gonna call type to fun. Alex used the term type to fun on you can't cheat with the show notes. Um, used the term type to fun during the last podcast, and I will confess it just went right over that because we were in the middle of the conversation. But I realized when she sent me another link that I had no idea what she was talking about when she said type to fun. Did you do you know what type 2 fun is?

SPEAKER_00: 8:33

I had heard the term yes, but I guess I've never really dived into what it the meaning is.

SPEAKER_02: 8:39

Okay, so from an article from REI type one fun is enjoyable while it's happening, also known as simple fun, good food, sport climbing, powder skiing, margaritas. Got it. Um, I guess if you have too many margaritas, you end up in type two fun.

SPEAKER_00: 8:56

Should you really mix sport climbing and margaritas?

SPEAKER_02: 8:59

Not together. Those are individual fun things. They're just fun, they're good fun. Sure. Um, type two fun is miserable while it's happening, but fun in retrospect. Usually begins with the best intentions and then things get carried away.

SPEAKER_00: 9:15

Is this REI's definition?

SPEAKER_02: 9:16

REI wrote this article. So No, I think that's the idea. The idea was we were talking about how um with Alex and Jason, like the cycling, she didn't like cycling until it became harder. And that's when she was like, until it can't be type two. Right. Until and then it turned out she just likes she likes type.

SPEAKER_00: 9:36

We we have talked about this, and you know, because cyclists put ourselves through a lot of different events that we that are hard. Yes. And then when you get to the end and you go, Yeah, we're coming back next year. Yes. So that's the type two fun. But I wouldn't don't know if I would call it miserable while it's happening. I think that term is is off.

SPEAKER_02: 9:56

I don't know. I would say there were challenging while it's happening. Okay, I'll go challenging. There were but there have been moments like with Raspberry Pizza or even the last P2P where I was miserable for a couple of moments. That doesn't mean I don't want to go back to it. It does mean I don't want to do it the same way. You know, make sure my equipment's better or right. So and then there's type three fun, which is just no fun at all. Not even in retrospect. Afterward, you think, what the hell was I doing? If I'll if I ever come up with another idea that's stupid, somebody slaps some sense into me. That's type three fun.

SPEAKER_00: 10:30

Yeah. So so for means by type two. So like I am not a huge big distance rider. So, you know, so I would say the rift is gonna in Iceland is gonna be type two fun. Yes, right? Yep. And I although I wouldn't say miserable while it's happening, I would say challenging while it's miserable.

SPEAKER_02: 10:48

Hopefully not miserable while it's happening.

SPEAKER_00: 10:50

But if I were to do the 125-mile version, that would start kicking me into type three. Right? Because that's where there is there is a point where I get to the on a very, very long distance rider where it's like, I don't want to be sitting on the saddle anymore. My butt hurts. I you know, my hand my hands are maybe a little hurting, I'm starting to bonk, um, you know, I just wanna I just want to. And so that's why we're doing the shorter version because we wanted it to be type two fun, get to the end, enjoy the after party. I don't, yes.

SPEAKER_02: 11:29

I did ask you if you've ever wanted to do like tour divide, which is, you know, many, many, many, many right. And you have said no, or if you wanted to do what was the one, unbound XL or whatever the thing that just even even on like the unbound at 200 miles.

SPEAKER_00: 11:47

That that I just that doesn't interest. That's too much. That's too much. Would I do the shorter hundred mile unbound short because our friend Jeff said, though, are you really doing unbound? You have to put an asterisk next to that. You kind of do. Uh Leadville is Leadville's a hundred miles. I would do Leadville, and that's been on my list, like my bucket list.

SPEAKER_02: 12:05

I also, I mean, I will say I'm not a big fan of just. It's kind of like well, I'm just doing day one of the PMC. Ugh. I just want to say no, you're doing the PMC. Yes. I'm just doing the 50. You're doing the 50. Like, I anyway, we can debate this with Jeff when he comes on the show because he'll be on our next episode. So let's talk about uh you traveling.

SPEAKER_00: 12:30

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 12:30

We're gonna try you're traveling, and let's talk about you're bringing your bike. Your grapple bike.

SPEAKER_00: 12:38

Yes, I'm bringing my grandpa bike.

SPEAKER_02: 12:39

And but when you went to Iceland before, you didn't bring a bike. You were not mountain bikes.

SPEAKER_00: 12:45

No.

SPEAKER_02: 12:46

How do you decide?

SPEAKER_00: 12:47

I have I have opinions on this.

SPEAKER_02: 12:50

Good thing I asked you.

SPEAKER_00: 12:51

Okay. So here's my opinion about traveling with a bike. Okay. All right. Um road bikes, if you're going somewhere to road ride, yes, and you can rent now a lot of places you can go to road ride. And assuming you're either, well, either you're going with an outfit or a tour company, or there's you're going someplace that that that has uh shops and facilities that are cater to to bike tourism. Usually you can get a very nice road bike. So all you need to bring is your pedals and your measurements and your setup. Renting the bike there is usually a good way to go.

SPEAKER_04: 13:27

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 13:29

Uh so then let's go on to gravel.

SPEAKER_04: 13:32

Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 13:33

So, in terms of Iceland, like gravel, you probably have very specific setup. And uh you're gonna want the certain bags that you have on your bike. Um you need extra, I guess, gear in a lot of ways. You need to be prepared for a few extra things, and whether it's too like tubeless plugs and and a little bit more potential mechanical issues, so you want that kind of stuff, which you can bring with you and put on a rental bike, but it then there's tire choice and tire sizes. I was gonna say, do we have a huge part of gravel?

SPEAKER_02: 14:06

Rent gravel bike?

SPEAKER_00: 14:07

Yeah, that's a good question. I don't even know. Yeah, I don't yeah. Okay. Um, so there I would say you tend to be more uh bringing bringing your bike. Okay. Yep. And then and then mountain bike. So you're right, when I went to Iceland the first time, we went and we used um uh ice bike. So they are a uh uh tour company outfitter who just basically takes you on excursions to ride mountain bikes, and they had all the bikes. Yes, and that worked out quite well. So this is where it gets a little bit mountain bikes are also very personal in terms of how you're riding them and what you're used to, and so the more technical terrain you're probably doing, the more you're gonna want to bring your mountain bike, right? Your own mountain bike. Um, but this is gonna come into sort of uh I guess what you're really going to do.

SPEAKER_02: 15:04

So we went to Switzerland and we brought our bikes.

SPEAKER_00: 15:07

We did, and it was super expensive to bring our bikes. It was at the time. I don't know if it's as expensive anymore. A lot of airlines have reduced fees on that.

SPEAKER_02: 15:15

We're gonna talk about that next. Uh, but we did bring them, I think, because we liked we were moving around a lot. We were we were going to different parts of the country. Different parts of the country in a rental car. We could rent a bike in Zermatt and bring it to the other places, right? So we would have had to rent multiple places. And I did like the idea of that this is my bike, and it takes me a little bit to get used to my bike, so I liked bringing it. I have rented, I went to Austin once for a conference, and I've got to be.

SPEAKER_00: 15:47

If you're going for a conference and you just want to get out for a spin, rent a bike.

SPEAKER_02: 15:52

I brought my shoes, I brought my pedals. I rented a mountain bike, I rented a hardtail mountain bike. It was a little weird because you're like, yeah, this is not my bike. I don't ride a hardtail. That was the other thing. It was very kind of weird to be and it wasn't non-technical, right? Like it was it was pretty techie where I went, but it was nice to have that option that if you're just gonna go somewhere, you can rent a bike.

SPEAKER_00: 16:15

And when we went to Switzerland, I did look around at the different towns we're gonna be at. Yeah, I didn't really see the bikes that we want, yeah, like they were appropriate or they didn't show like our size or whatever it was, and it was sort of okay, I'm not gonna again as you said, we are also going from town to town, so right.

SPEAKER_02: 16:36

Okay, so how do I get my bike there? You're flying your bike.

SPEAKER_00: 16:40

I am flying the bike on Iceland Air. And you're putting they did have a decent fee. Um it was it was a hundred and eighty dollars round trip um to fly with the bike, which is more than a lot of domestic airlines now, where you can it's just basically a check bag fee for which is usually what fifty, sixty.

SPEAKER_02: 16:59

Um what do you put it in?

SPEAKER_00: 17:01

So I have Evoch bags. Yes, we have Evoch bags. We do. Yeah, and this is what we took to Switzerland, and and I I love them. And I've rent these out at the shop, and everybody has had no problems um on all their trips who have rented them.

SPEAKER_03: 17:20

Yep.

SPEAKER_00: 17:21

So with the Evoch bag, the both wheels come off. The the bike goes in the center of the bag, the wheels go on the outside in pouches, basic sort of protecting the the bike in the middle, and um, and it's it's a soft-sided bag.

SPEAKER_02: 17:36

But you don't have to put how much do you have to put like do I have to take my handlebars off? Like, how much do I need to be able to mantle, dismantle, or remantle?

SPEAKER_00: 17:47

The seat post comes out, okay. The pedals come off, and the handle, so you can do it in two ways with the handlebar. You can take the handlebar off of the stem, and then that kind of gets tucked down to the side, or you can take the stem off of the fork and and on keep keep the handlebar on and tuck that whole system down.

SPEAKER_02: 18:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 18:06

Um because they are still attached to cables. Yeah, that can just depend on the setup of your bike on which way you do the front.

SPEAKER_02: 18:13

Can you put other stuff in that bag, like your shoes, your helmet, or you like what else?

SPEAKER_00: 18:19

It depends on the weight limit. And this is where travel bike bags, you really have to look at what you're getting. So I know some people have hard-sided ones, and those will theoretically protect the bike better, but they weigh a lot more. And depending on the airline, some airlines have 50 pound weight limits. And if you have a 25 pound, 20, 25 pound case or bag, before it's well, it's empty. You now basically are sometimes lucky to just get the bike in and meet the 50 pounds. Okay. Right? Right. And especially with a mountain bike. Right. Now with a road bike, usually you're under 20. So but uh with Iceland Air, it's actually 70 pounds. So with that kind of with my gravel bike, which is under 20, and the Evoch bag, which is under 20, uh, it's probably around I have to wait it, but it's probably about 15. Um then that gives me a I'll put my my shoes in there, my helmet, uh, bike tools. I'll stuff all of my gels into them the bags in there. Yeah, I mean, babe, and and and I a gear, uh kit I'll put in there. I mean, basically everything I can fit into that bag will just go into that bag.

SPEAKER_02: 19:28

And the nice thing about that Evoc bag is it does roll really nicely. Like it travels. You've got your bag, your backpack, and you've got this big bike bag, but it actually it's very nimble. It's a nice bag. But say you don't have a bag, you can't rent a bag. Can you just use a bike? You can.

SPEAKER_00: 19:44

Yes, you can take a bike box on a on a plane. Um the so the biggest thing about a bike box is that what are you gonna do with it at the end? So so you're gonna well, you get to the airport and you're gonna probably Then you're gonna need a cart to rule to get it out of the airport. Right. Uh then what are you gonna do when what are you have you like a rental car? Are you just getting on like a hotel bus? Oh, that's that could be a problem. Right. So you can see like because it's cause it's a lot bigger than the Evoch bag.

SPEAKER_02: 20:23

Do you d um and what if it's subject to inspection? Right? Because I mean they they can they can try to open a box.

SPEAKER_00: 20:32

They can't oh yeah, absolutely. And that definitely happened.

SPEAKER_02: 20:35

So what would happen if they tried to open your box that's been like taped within an inch of its life?

SPEAKER_00: 20:41

I I don't that I'm assuming this has happened. I'm assuming that they've they've uned up the tops of these boxes and hopefully they're taping it back down. Right.

SPEAKER_02: 20:51

But how much would it be to ship it? Have you did you ever think of shipping it? Like I know a lot of people use bike flights to ship ships.

SPEAKER_00: 20:59

Shipping domestically could make sense. So shipping it to your destination?

SPEAKER_02: 21:03

Yeah, so like bike flights has a program that you can ship, if I understand it, that you can ship like you. I could bring you my bike, say I'm going out to Unbound. Can you pack this up for me? You charge me for that, of course. And then you ship it by bike flights to a shop on the other end. Yep. And then they put it together.

SPEAKER_00: 21:25

Right.

SPEAKER_02: 21:25

That there would be an extra fee for that.

SPEAKER_00: 21:28

Way more than flying with your bike in a bag. But could it be safer for your bag?

SPEAKER_02: 21:35

Bags are expensive though, but yeah, but could it be safer for your bike? Like, what's the risk to the bike getting chucked into?

SPEAKER_00: 21:43

Oh, I don't oh, I I think that there's probably more hands and more transfers if you ship it than there is if you fly with it. So I don't think there's a risk, a greater risk either way. Right. Um, but right nowadays, um UPS to to ship a bike in a box is usually over a hundred dollars each way, right? And if you take it to a shop to get packed up, you could be looking at a hundred dollars just to get it packed up because it does take quite a bit of time.

SPEAKER_02: 22:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 22:14

So that's usually why you're better off trying to do it yourself if you can. Yep. But but if for a lot of domestic airlines now it's just a check bag, so now you're only looking at fifty, sixty dollars each way. Right. So you can see how it could be a lot cheaper to fly.

SPEAKER_02: 22:28

Yeah, but I could also see why it would be convenient to ship it.

SPEAKER_00: 22:33

Well, so here's a good one about the bike box. So our friend Bob, he flew, he was just in Spain. Yes, he was.

SPEAKER_02: 22:43

And doing other ridiculous things on bikes.

SPEAKER_00: 22:46

Right. So So the two of them, they they got rid of their bike boxes when they got there, put the bikes together in the airport, and rode out of the airport. Right, and then they where did they try to and then so they did what's called the El Camino Trail, which is across uh starts in basically south of France and then basically across northern Spain. So they couldn't bring the boxes, but so then they had to no, and then they had called ahead at a I believe a decathlon somewhere in Spain to ask them to put boxes out for them. And then there was a whole thing, I guess Bob had to walk like five miles to go get to this decathlon or something to get the boxes, but they were broken down. So then he had to find a store to get tape so he could put the uh reassemble the you know the boxes which were flat packed and this was just so he could put them on a plane to go home.

SPEAKER_02: 23:35

He was not shipping them, he just couldn't they're there, they're not gonna take them as is. Right. So yeah, it's a bit of logistics. It's kind of like when Chris finished the um tour divide, right? He got to the end and now you gotta find somewhere to you get you get to the to the border. Yep. You're like, yay, I finished it. Okay, I'm gonna go find somewhere to back up my bike to find a box somewhere.

SPEAKER_00: 24:01

So certainly challenging. The Evoch bag has these sort of rigid fiberglass stays that you put in, yeah, that it retains its shape, but you can just pull those out easily and then it and then it flat packs sort of down to its base.

SPEAKER_02: 24:14

Yes, but you still wouldn't.

SPEAKER_00: 24:15

So you could fit it into a if you had to, you could you could get your take your bike out and then and then compress the case down to get it into a vehicle somehow.

SPEAKER_02: 24:26

Right, but you're not bringing it on the El Camino. No, no, no. That's it, that's a different thing.

SPEAKER_00: 24:30

And of course, if you're flying in to a different place than you're flying out, that's why it couldn't keep a box.

SPEAKER_02: 24:36

Right. Right. I guess you could you could you could pack the the bag flat, you could ship that to your final destination. Ooh. When you get there, it would be waiting for you, and you could pop it out, but then you're only shipping the the flat EVON.

SPEAKER_00: 24:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 24:54

Unless you didn't know where you were gonna end up.

SPEAKER_00: 24:56

You just came up with a new idea.

SPEAKER_02: 24:57

Oh, there you go. Always thinking about logistics. What are some things you should think about when you're traveling that maybe you would plan on taking that you can't?

SPEAKER_00: 25:09

That I can't take with me?

SPEAKER_02: 25:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 25:14

Oh, CO2 cartridges. So you can't fly with CO2 cartridges. You're welcome. There if you if you search this on the internet, you're gonna see people say, Oh, I had CO2 cartridges in my check bags, and like sometimes just like, nah, they never found them, they got through, I have them. Okay. Other times you're like, oh, yeah, they found them and they took them out. So uh it's one of those cases.

SPEAKER_02: 25:36

Why can't I bring a CO2 cartridge?

SPEAKER_00: 25:38

Because it's compressed gas, it's it's technically explosive, if you will, if if the thing were to burst. Okay. That so that brings up this uh, I guess, old myth and uh about deflating your tires. Oh there was a there's an application for it in the past. So the airlines will say, like, if you're bringing your bike, please deflate the tires and that kind of thing.

SPEAKER_02: 26:03

Oh because of the pressure. Because of the pressure in the okay. Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 26:08

But nowadays with with modern bikes, where we're not you know, even road bikes nowadays are not going over 75 psi in most cases. Yep. Um, you know, my gravel bike is gonna be at 25. So if even in a fully unpressurized cargo hold at 50,000 feet, the increase in pressure is about nine psi.

SPEAKER_02: 26:33

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 26:34

So it's not it, this is not something that's gonna affect really any tire. What's the downside to doing it? If you but I was gonna say in the old days, if you were if you had like a track bike and you're at 200 psi, right? And and and then so then it could be a situation where you could blow off the up the rim, I suppose, especially in with old tires and old rims. But okay, but it's back in the day.

SPEAKER_02: 26:56

Is the issue now, you're tubeless, which means you got goo in there. Yep. So if you deflate them, could you end up with goo all over your bike bag?

SPEAKER_00: 27:05

No, no, no. So d you don't want to deflate them all the way.

SPEAKER_02: 27:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 27:10

So I will probably do it anyway. I'll probably take them down to 20 PSI and then they're good.

SPEAKER_02: 27:16

Okay. Right. So not totally flat, but not rideable.

SPEAKER_00: 27:19

So I'll have a hand pump on me on my bike because we can't bring CO2. Now, one of our friends is gonna try to find some CO2 cartridges in Reykjavik when we get there. Um try to buy a 20-pack or something.

SPEAKER_02: 27:32

Ship them to yourself to an Amazon locker in Reykjavik. There's gotta be an Amazon locker that you could be like, but it's probably one at the airport.

SPEAKER_00: 27:42

We can look. I can look to see if if there's Amazons in Reykjavik. They don't have McDonald's there. I don't know if they have Amazon there. Well, it seems like that kind of place. No, no Amazon.

SPEAKER_02: 27:54

No Amazon in the entire island. I mean, if that's true, kudos to Iceland. I think that would be awesome. What else? Do you pack any extra stuff? Like extra shoes, extra, like, or do you just one and done? You know me, I would I would have like two pairs of mountain bike shoes and I would have No, I'm not gonna pair pack extra shoes.

SPEAKER_00: 28:16

Okay. Although with 70 pound weight limit, I could technically throw an extra pair of shoes. There I don't know if there's a if there's a need for that.

SPEAKER_02: 28:24

What's the weather gonna be?

SPEAKER_00: 28:25

What's the Iceland in the summertime is typically in the 50s. Um, they are supposed to be having a heat wave next week. So we could be looking at like 61, 62 degrees, which is just gonna be balmy. That's weird. Um, yep. Okay.

SPEAKER_04: 28:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 28:43

But that's that's typically the weather. And and the weather changes rapidly and often there.

SPEAKER_02: 28:48

And the other thing back on the traveling with the bike, you found out inadvertently, is that there was a limit on the number of bikes that could go on each flight. Yes. Which I guess you wouldn't normally have to worry about, except you've got all these people. I mean, this is a pretty popular This is a big this is a big event.

SPEAKER_00: 29:09

So you have people flying in from all over the place. And Boston is a I don't want to call it a hub, it's probably like a hub-ish for for Iceland air. If you're if you're coming from um, you know, I don't know how many direct flights there are from a lot of places in the United States, so it's very, very um uh, you know, uh possible that you're flying through Boston to get to Iceland. And so yep.

SPEAKER_02: 29:31

So somebody clued you into that.

SPEAKER_00: 29:33

Yeah, when I made the when I booked the tickets, um there was nothing about a limit. Uh no, there was nothing about booking a bike separately.

SPEAKER_04: 29:43

Oh.

SPEAKER_00: 29:43

And it and it was only a couple weeks ago I said, you know, is is that check bag my one check bag allowance? Is that include my bike? And I went on the website and I looked and was like, oh no, you have to, that's when I found you had to pay for your your bike. And it was way more expensive if you did it under a week from your trip.

SPEAKER_02: 30:01

Right.

SPEAKER_00: 30:02

So um I put out on our Slack group to all the guys going to Iceland, I said, Oh, you know, you should book your butt your bike if you haven't done that. Yeah. And then somebody came in and said, Oh, each plane only has a limit of 10 bikes. So I, you know, and and they had it was either him or somebody he knew had to change their flight because they were out of space for bikes. And and then everybody was panicking.

unknown: 30:27

Right.

SPEAKER_00: 30:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 30:29

Nobody was working. The the the uh productivity of that crew dropped for an hour or two as they figured out the all right. Yeah that's exciting. Well, we're gonna take a quick break, and when we come back, we're gonna go through some questions. We're gonna hit a QA session.

SPEAKER_03: 30:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 30:52

All right, we're back. Well, Iceland did not reject Amazon.

SPEAKER_00: 30:57

No, I there is Amazon and Iceland, but no lockers. So I can take a look to see if they will deliver to the hotel.

SPEAKER_02: 31:04

It's just an idea. I mean, it's one less thing to worry about. Yep. That would be that's what I would do, but I'm not going to Iceland.

SPEAKER_00: 31:13

A pump is fine.

SPEAKER_02: 31:14

We are going to do uh STBG QA.

SPEAKER_00: 31:19

Did I know about this? Nope. Okay. Here we go. I guess so.

SPEAKER_02: 31:23

Some of them you knew, some of you you didn't. All right. This one is inspired by conversations we have had at the bike shop with our women's rides. Which is what is the difference between or how does the average consumer new rider? I am an average new rider tell the difference between a mountain bike style bike and a mountain bike. And an entry-level mountain bike.

SPEAKER_00: 31:52

Okay. So a lot of a lot. And many entry-level mountain, I'm gonna quote air quote mountain bikes. Okay. Um, because these are the the bikes that I'm gonna consider mountain bike style, not true mountain bikes. Okay. Um these have parts that even if you were to look on the manufacturer's website from say Shimano, they are not intended to be used on trails other than basically dirt roads. Okay. Okay. Um, and so there is a there's actually a category classification that some manufacturers will put on their mountain bikes. There'll be a little sticker.

SPEAKER_04: 32:40

Oh.

SPEAKER_00: 32:40

Um, and so it's one through, I think, five. Okay. And that gives you uh sort of a condition situation of what the bike is intended for. Okay. So I'm gonna read say uh, well, here, like like level five, that would be the highest. So bike category five. This is a set of conditions for operation of a bicycle that includes conditions one, two, three, and four, obviously. Extreme jumping or downhill grades on rough trails at speeds in excess of 25 miles per hour. That would be like a downhill bike. Many trail bikes and all mountain bikes and and serious mountain bikes are going to be condition four. Some cross-country bikes may be just conditions three, so I'll read the middle one here. A set of conditions for operation of a bicycle that includes one and two, as well as as well as rough trails, rough unpaved roads, rough terrain, and unimproved trails that require technical skills, jumps, and drops less than 24 inches. So serious sort of mountain bikes are gonna be three, four, five. Okay. If you look at one, it's basically operation of a bicycle on regular paved surface where the tires are intended intended to mean ground contact. You may find what looks like a mountain bike and it's condition one.

SPEAKER_02: 34:01

Well, that's the big thing seems to be it's a front fork. I think people, if you look at a bike and it has a front suspension fork on the bike, and use uh flat bar, knobby tires, and a front suspension fork.

SPEAKER_00: 34:16

Yes, right.

SPEAKER_02: 34:17

How would you know if that is a mountain bike? I'll throw like truck under the bus. How would you know if that's a if that trek is a mountain bike style bike, perfect for rail trails and not for actual trails, single track, and a mountain bike. Right.

SPEAKER_00: 34:38

And you're saying the levels and the the categories, yes, which not all manufacturers are gonna provide on the a sticker for on the frame.

SPEAKER_04: 34:45

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 34:46

And so the very entry-level parts from Shimano would uh for so Tourney is one is their sort of entry-level group set. Okay, and that is just not made to go to go off-road. It it will break very, very quickly. And uh and you know, the funny thing is is a lot of what you would think would be strong parts, so parts made of steel in many cases, not aluminum. So the bike that's entry-level bikes can be a lot heavier because of the use of more steel. Yep, it's very often that steel, those steel parts is weaker and will bend easier than aluminum parts. Okay. Because the aluminum parts are much more engineered to handle the ticket that's gonna be.

SPEAKER_02: 35:36

Well, and how about like gearing? Because I know we were looking at a bike that was mountain bike style, and what it had was a two in the front, two.

SPEAKER_00: 35:48

Which is yep.

SPEAKER_02: 35:49

But then a very little cassette back. Yeah. And so just to keep that thing rolling was gonna take so much energy. Like you just couldn't, you couldn't climb some of the things that are in the woods.

SPEAKER_00: 36:03

Certainly not around here, no. No.

SPEAKER_02: 36:05

Right. So that maybe is something else to look at. Is the gearing to know if it's really ultimately you should be asking. You need to tell you need to be clear with whoever you're buying the bike from. Yes. And say, This is what I'm planning on riding.

SPEAKER_00: 36:21

And if it does have a sticker, stay away from condition one, category one. Yes, right. You want to look at least for category two.

SPEAKER_02: 36:27

Okay. Yeah. Well, there you go. All right. Another from our women's mountain bike ride. We were talking about keeping our butt off the saddle, what percentage. Um, it was a good conversation. I actually had someone this weekend say, tell me that he listened to the show and then told one of his friends that he realized one of the big reasons he was struggling with mountain biking is he was sitting in his saddle too much. So win for education. I had a rider this weekend, week, who when she's going downhill or level pedals, her left foot is always forward. That is her that is her dominant foot, and she's putting pressure on her right foot. That's the one always back. And she's having some pain, so she wants to switch so that she's right left. Is there any magic trick to doing that?

SPEAKER_00: 37:21

Because practice. Yeah. Practice. Yeah, you had asked me what what foot I put forward, and I had to think about it. In fact, my initial thought was actually wrong until I got on the until I got on the bike.

SPEAKER_02: 37:36

You thought it was your kicking football. So I be back. What did you think? You thought your kicking foot would be forward, I think.

SPEAKER_00: 37:44

No? Well, no. I am left-handed, but in high school, I was not I switched my kicking foot from left to right. Okay. Uh, because of course, back in our day in high school, we played a lot of kickball. Um and I just was not finding the sport of champions. Yes. Yes, okay. And and so and so when I let's see, I when I am on a skateboard, I am left foot forward.

SPEAKER_02: 38:10

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 38:11

Okay. But I believe I found out when I my preference for level pedals on a mountain bike is right foot forward.

SPEAKER_02: 38:18

Right. And my preference is left foot forward, and my kicking leg is my right leg.

SPEAKER_00: 38:24

Yeah, but then you switch, you switch and you said, Well, this feels weird.

SPEAKER_02: 38:27

Oh, yeah, it felt it felt horrible.

SPEAKER_00: 38:29

And I switched and I said, Well, this feels no different. So I I think I am very ambidextrous in terms of foot forward. It doesn't matter to me.

SPEAKER_02: 38:36

Yep.

SPEAKER_00: 38:37

Um, but I can see that being the case, not the case for a lot of people.

SPEAKER_02: 38:40

It's a good, it's a good skill to have to, I have to practice. I have to practice. So you also talked about the fact that we talked on the last episode about how you lock your legs sometimes when you're going down. And that did make a difference when I tried being right foot forward and then I locked my legs. I thought, oh, this is a little more comfortable, but I could see the muscle memory already. My when I swap, when I swap, I can be left foot forward, right back for hours. At the end of a long downhill day, yes, I feel fatigued.

SPEAKER_04: 39:13

Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 39:13

The minute I swapped it, we were on flat. I swapped it. My back left leg was like, no, no, ouchy. Ouchie. Like it started to fatigue almost immediately. So it was partially the muscles there are not as well defined, developed. When I locked up, yes, I could do it. I could tell I could do it longer, and I definitely see the value of being ambidextrous in my feet.

SPEAKER_00: 39:39

Yeah, but I think at first the answer is that is that leg locked, that straight leg position where you're sort of sitting very high up on the bike, legs straight, kind of butt back. And that's so you're not using your leg muscles to support your weight. You're you're basically using your skeleton to support your weight. And this is a way to uh Rest, if you will, while you're while you're riding. And and then you, while we were watching the women's mountain bike roll cup from Andorra this morning, you were like, Oh, look, they're locking. Oh, look, they're locking. They're looking at locking.

SPEAKER_02: 40:12

Yeah. I I I say this all the time. I love watching the women's mountain bike racing. No offense to the dudes, but they just have more finesse. I like I like watching them for their technique. I like seeing how she's a great race. Oh, it was a great race today. But I I remember when I started watching the women's mountain bike racing, and I was like, oh my gosh, they are always pedaling. Or I mean not always. Obviously, there are times when they're just going downhill, but they are pedaling more than I was naturally peddling pedaling. And which is similar to Cyclocross. That with pedal is power and traction, and they just pedal a ton. They keep light in their pedals, but you can see the different techniques, right? You can see how like Jenny Rizved is is quiet on her bike, centered.

SPEAKER_00: 41:03

And then Alexandra Yeller is just everywhere on her bike.

SPEAKER_02: 41:07

All over her bike. And clearly both are right, right? They're both, they are both champion riders.

SPEAKER_00: 41:13

Both podiumed.

SPEAKER_02: 41:14

Both podiumed. Um it's just fascinating, right? It's I love watching them. And it does. It there are moments you go, oh, okay, wait, that's what he's talking about. Locking, they locked in. It was the end of the ride, they clearly raced, they're clearly fatigued, and they're using that technique to save a little bit.

SPEAKER_00: 41:34

Yeah, you know where you see it a lot is is the flyovers. So they like there was a particular flyover, they were climbing, climbing, climbing, and then they had to go up up the steep the slope of a flyover. And every single one of them on that final lap was just humping them theirselves over the lip of that flyover. I mean, you could just tell the fatigue on their legs, and then there's sort of you you you make a couple pedal strokes and they and the legs lock because you have to unload those muscles for a minute. And you actually even can go down the back side of the of the of the um flyover with legs locked because it's nice and smooth and so forth, because they just needed to take the pressure off their muscles for a few seconds.

SPEAKER_02: 42:17

I've never been a big sports watcher, but maybe it's because I was not a very big sports player, right? Like I don't didn't play tennis, I don't watch tennis. I didn't play basketball, I don't have a lot of interest in basketball. I I mountain bike, I do enjoy watching mountain biking. Not that I think I would not that I'm like looking at it going, I could totally do absolutely not. I just stand in awe of these women, they're amazing. All right. Alright, what's next? Here's a here's a bike clothing question from our friend Megan. What's the deal with the little caps road and gravel riders wear under their helmets? I'm always so confused. Do I wear one? Will it make me hot? Keep me warm? Is it a fashion? Will it make me ride faster?

SPEAKER_00: 43:04

Okay, with no research into this, here is my here is my thought on the caps.

SPEAKER_03: 43:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_00: 43:09

So the caps have been around for decades and decades. Deep hits. They they are before helmets. And they were helmets. So they were a way to keep the sun off your head. They're uh an advertising mechanism. Uh they the brim on them, which was kind of flips up and down. Um that is a way to keep the rain from going into your eyes if it's raining. Yep. And so nowadays you really rarely see people wear a cycling cap under a helmet, but again, it can help with rain, and it can also help with a little bit of warmth should you be have conditions that need that. But otherwise, and they were also made of cotton because again, they were made 50 years ago. They were made with wool and wool too. Yeah. So uh that now wool actually is a good wicking material. Cotton is horrible, so you really don't necessarily want to wear a cycling cap on your helmet.

SPEAKER_02: 44:06

It's it's I'm gonna contradict you a little bit. I mean, we haven't been to a cyclocross race for a while. I do remember when we were really into cyclocross, those little caps were everywhere. They were they were pretty popular amongst the cross group, and I suspect they might be popular in the gravel group. I haven't seen many on your road on road. You're absolutely right. I don't see them as much. Um I always hated them because I have a gigantic noggin and they never fit me. I mean, I think everyone looks a little ridiculous in them. There's some people look really cute. I'm not one of those people.

SPEAKER_00: 44:41

So in gravel, I suppose, again, if it's not too hot, but gravel can be very dusty on some of these races and courses, and that's gonna keep all of that dirt from going into your hair and your head, and then potentially making you hotter by clogging up your scalpel.

SPEAKER_02: 44:57

Right, well, that's what I was gonna say. I have I do have one now, so I found a company, I want to say it's called like walls or something, that they do ones for big heads, they're made of athletic material. I did wear it one season, I wore it for PMC Unpaved. Our first PMC Unpaved, it was the Amy Foundation, so it's got like cute. I found it was really nice for controlling my hair. I get really annoyed with the wispies that come out the side. It was a little rainy that day, so I did have it flipped down, which was nice. It had a little bit and uh and it does give you that little bit of shade. Yep. But it I'm torn on that because it is a lot of extra fabric and it can pop the helmet up a little bit, which is sometimes annoying. Like it it's just a lot of stuff on your face when you've got the helmet, the cap, the glasses, the buff, whatever else you have going on. Um, but yeah, there's not they're not gonna make you faster. They might make you look cooler. You might be able to pull it off, Megan. I can't pull them off. We had a great one from Rafa. Uh we probably have it kicking around somewhere. It was a winter one. Oh, it was a winter one and it had ear flaps, it had ear flaps and it had the stripes and it had the, but really the only person who could wear it was Sophie. And she looked adorable in it.

SPEAKER_00: 46:19

That was a Jeremy Powers uh Rafa focus uh kit one.

SPEAKER_02: 46:23

Oh yes, because it had those those colors. Yeah, it had the their flag. All right, here's a bake bike maintenance question.

SPEAKER_00: 46:30

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 46:30

I was cruising through some Facebook groups looking looking for questions, I'll admit. Ladies, the past year's riding, I've always just dropped my bike off to the mechanics and said, do whatever is needed and build me. She has a track tool suspension. She posted a picture of it, it was very pretty.

SPEAKER_04: 46:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_02: 46:46

I was traveling 100%, didn't have time to even think. Now, life has shifted gears, and I'm curious what people are spending annually on bike maintenance. I'm about to drop off my track for almost$2,000 in work. Short and dropper overhauled and other stuff. I seem to spend two to three K a year on maintenance. Wondering if this is normal. Thank you in advance. Now, she did reveal later in her conversation she rides that bike eight to ten hours a week. She rides a lot.

SPEAKER_00: 47:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 47:15

Somebody said in response, there was a lot of responses, nothing consistent. But my bike mechanic told me I should expect to spend at least$1,000 a year on bike maintenance and service. My shock and drop reposed once a year. The cost is$560. I live in the Pacific Northwest and ride one to five hours a week. Um,$2,000 a year to maintain my mountain bike seems like a lot. So I thought I would ask you what your initial reaction was, which of course you already gave me.

SPEAKER_00: 47:43

I I did already give you, didn't I? Yes. What? Uh yeah. That was a spontaneous response.

SPEAKER_02: 47:51

Everything else was like two grand a year, you could just not service it for three years and get a new bike. Right?

SPEAKER_00: 47:58

Like So that's absolutely right. Yeah. I I suppose that that does I haven't thought about like that either, but that's crazy. I I I think that's a crazy amount of money.

SPEAKER_04: 48:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 48:09

I don't even like not just from my uh general understanding of the the industry standard pricing of most things, I can't even see how you can come up with that much money. Right.

SPEAKER_02: 48:22

I wanna think about a a high-end dual suspension mountain bike, yeah, someone who rides it all the time, all year.

SPEAKER_00: 48:30

Yeah, what do you think would be a I don't know how often they're going through chains.

SPEAKER_02: 48:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 48:36

I do know that some shops are like, oh, you need a chain, so you need a new cassette. And and of course you don't if you keep up on your chains.

SPEAKER_02: 48:45

Yeah, actually that's the whole point in replacing the chains is to SRAM like eagle cassettes are expensive.

SPEAKER_00: 48:50

And let's say she has a very nice bike with maybe X an XO cassette. That's a$400,$450 cassette. Okay. Right? So that starts to add up if they're if that's what they're saying, which is not the case, but um and then the the shock work, that's that's only like I mean, the rear so the rear shock just basically gets seals and fluid, say every year.

SPEAKER_04: 49:19

Okay.

SPEAKER_00: 49:19

All right. And there's a there's part of that the the thing now that is if it's not leaking, if the seals aren't leaking, you you're good to go, and you don't need to do the the damper in the rear shock all the time. All right, unless that goes. But let's say you're just doing that. Those that's that service is is quick and easy. I mean, and and usually that is under let's just say 70 for for including the seals. Okay. And then the fork, the just the normal 50 hour service, so I don't know how often she's taking it in for that. That service is usually under 100. And and then even if it needed like the damper seals and all that kind of stuff, you're still you're still under under two. Like, I just don't see how this is adding up to$2,000. Yeah. I mean, even including all the the sort of tune-up labor time and that kind of stuff. Yep. Yeah. I was just curious. Can I see somebody spending a thousand dollars a year on maintenance who rides a full suspension mountain bike and is all the time? Yeah, I guess that's potentially yes. Okay. Um if they don't have a bigger thing. I will also say that some people Yeah, they don't do anything themselves. That's true, if they don't do anything themselves. Um it is also the case where some people are way harder on their bikes than others. And and and that can affect the case.

SPEAKER_02: 50:43

Well, we've talked I mean, we've talked about that. We've talked about that if you were maybe a newer generation rider, maybe you started with the good stuff, right? That you might be having the bike do more of the work than your body is doing, and so you're bashing it against things, right? And so you might be breaking more things than someone who's a gentler rider or has better body English does. Yep. Right? But that's not normal maintenance. That's you breaking up.

SPEAKER_00: 51:14

There's also the pivot points, also all the pivot bearings on a full suspension bike. And that and that's um that is not a quick service, it's not all that pricey. Uh, but it's again, that's a case where it's as needed. Yes. Right?

SPEAKER_02: 51:32

So that's not oh, it's not automatic. You don't automatically replace the pivot.

SPEAKER_00: 51:36

No, if I were if I if I were a race mechanic and I had a professional professional racer that I was looking after, yes, I would be looking at those bearings very often, but they don't go bad quickly or easily. Okay. So because they only rotate fractions of a millimeter. Uh pivot bearing in a frame doesn't make a full rotation. It only just rocks back and forth just a little bit. Okay. And so it actually takes more contamination that gets in through the seals over time to make them go bad rather than use.

SPEAKER_02: 52:12

Okay. Yeah, it seemed like a lot, as I say, it seemed like a lot. Some of the response the responses were just interesting. Um, all over the board on whether or not that they was they thought that was normal or not normal. All right, those are all my questions I had. Would you like to talk about the scene while scrolling? That's driving me crazy.

SPEAKER_00: 52:30

We have been mentioning and talking and just sort of circling around this 32-inch wheel mountain bike situation.

SPEAKER_02: 52:40

It's never gonna happen, Kristen. Don't worry about it.

SPEAKER_00: 52:43

Did I say that? Yeah, you said you No, I said I don't want it to happen.

SPEAKER_02: 52:47

Ah, okay. Maybe I just interpreted it.

SPEAKER_00: 52:49

And here we have well, it was a bike, some bike company I don't know if I've heard of.

SPEAKER_02: 52:54

It was no, no, no, it was BMC.

SPEAKER_00: 52:56

Oh, it was BMC. Yeah. Okay. So BMC. They posted a 32-inch wheeled mountain bike that they were testing at uh Andorra World Cup this weekend. It was not in the race, but they said they were sort of testing it on the side. So probably had a couple professional riders riding the course and so forth. Yeah, yeah. Yep. And so I think I mentioned this is going to come because it's a way for mountain bike companies to sell new mountain bikes. I'm sorry. And that is the only reason why.

SPEAKER_02: 53:27

I'm so mad.

SPEAKER_00: 53:29

And there are way more shorter riders who cannot find a bike that fits properly on 29 because of the frame design than there are tall riders who need bigger weeds.

SPEAKER_02: 53:40

That's what I'm saying. I'm saying if you want to sell more stuff to get more people on bikes, then come up with a better bike for shorter people.

SPEAKER_00: 53:50

They're they're out there, but a lot of companies ignore it.

SPEAKER_02: 53:53

They're ignoring, I'm just saying, if if if you're looking for, I'm gonna put my marketing hat on here, if you're looking for a audience to grow, to get to sell more bicycles, it is not tall people, it is shorter people, right? Make them more comfortable. And I'm not even just talking women. We just had a rider at the shop the other day, and he's five eight, so he's not short, oh yes, but he has a shorter leg.

SPEAKER_00: 54:24

Very short legs and long torso.

SPEAKER_02: 54:26

Yes, exactly. And it is outrageous to me that the industry is focused on going that way and not the other way.

SPEAKER_00: 54:34

Yeah, and two different brands, even even he protected because of his torso, he needed a medium, but even the small, two different brands that I looked at possible for him, both were too tall.

SPEAKER_02: 54:46

And I mean, this is someone who wants to buy a bike from us, but I said to him, please think about this really carefully because I cannot have you cursing us every time you get off this bike. Right? Right. I just I can't. I can't you have to be comfortable. You have to feel like you can. I remember speaking with one of the women about this. You need to feel like you can get off this bike quickly without concern that you're gonna smack your hoo-ha, right? So, like, because otherwise you won't be safe. You won't be safe because you won't you won't feel like you can just jump off the bike.

SPEAKER_00: 55:21

These 32-inch wheel mountain bikes, uh, to be clear, they're going to be marketed towards us, right? I started on a 26, I skipped over the 27 and a half, and you know, and now I'm at 29. Oh, did you?

SPEAKER_02: 55:33

So now we did plus tires?

SPEAKER_00: 55:35

20 27 and a half was 10% over 26, 29 is 10% over 27.5, and now 32 is 10% over 29. And so it is going is yes, taller riders will have a benefit, but it is going to be marketed towards the standard rider and saying all the things that they said about 29s, that the more rollover it has, the it's going those things may be true. Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 56:00

I get it. It just annoys me that we have a problem. We're going in the not in the wrong do both then. If if if the whole idea is that you want to come up with something cool to sell, then go for the larger audience because it's not just shorter people. I don't know the average height of people, so I'm not gonna tell you like on average, people are shorter, but tall kids, right?

SPEAKER_00: 56:28

We reach a point with children, teenagers, where they're like between they're not they're too big for kids' bikes, too small, four foot, let's let's call it like four foot eight, four foot nine to five foot. That range right there is so tough. You can if parents with kids or very short adults, yes, that is such an impossible.

SPEAKER_02: 56:50

But let's just talk about those parents with kids. If you can fit that need, then that is a future rider forever. But if they can't find a bike at that age, that size, they could be done, which means we've lost a potential future rider. Okay. Just saying.

SPEAKER_00: 57:09

Yeah, and what's gonna happen then is that these companies are all gonna come out with 32-inch wheel bikes, and then three, thour, three, four, five years, they're be like, well, that geometry was junk. We were just getting it right. That was the that was the start of our 32-inch here. This one's much better. Now buy this one. This is gonna be the trend. This is gonna be the the the way they they just can't wanna keep selling bikes. Yep.

SPEAKER_02: 57:37

I guess that's it for this week. A couple of other notes. We've started raising money for our PMC Unpaved. Yes. Um, for the which benefits the Dana Farmer Cancer Institute. So we'll have links to those if you want to help Steve in particular, because he's just getting he's he's behind me, man. I've taken the whole shot.

SPEAKER_00: 57:59

I don't like asking for money, and so I am very bad at fundraising.

SPEAKER_02: 58:03

It there reaches a point with it where it's like I'm giving money to you and you're giving money to me. Yeah, I know, I know. And it it it does feel a little um it's hard, but but there's that going on. And in fact, while we're speaking of the PMC, they released the safety video. Yes, that I was. Me and my crooked helmet. So we'll share a link.

SPEAKER_00: 58:27

Not an every scene, but there was just a little crooked in some of the some of the shots.

SPEAKER_02: 58:31

It's always crooked. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00: 58:33

I think you have a misshaped.

SPEAKER_02: 58:34

I have a pointy head. I have an awkward head. I don't know exactly. Let's wrap this up. Cycling Together with Kristen and Steve is a production of Steve the Bike Guy, an independent bicycle shop in Eastern Massachusetts and Sundon Marketing.

SPEAKER_00: 58:49

If you like the show, please leave a review or share with a friend, and for show notes, links, or to leave a comment, question, or topic suggestion, please visit cycling together.bike.

SPEAKER_02: 58:57

You can follow the shop on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, and now on TikTok. Cause why not, at Steve the Bike Guy. Thank you for joining the ride.

SPEAKER_00: 59:06

Alright, see you next time.